Trashwave

[esꙮteria]

Hello!

I've been a witch house listener for 10 years-ish, and some of my favorite artists include SADWRIST and 666Vandal, who pushed the boundaries of the genre towards more saturated, noisy and fast-paced tracks.
And despite loving their kind of music, I only recently discovered the umbrella term used for this kind of tracks: "Trashwave".

Now, as a genre nerd, I'd like to start a discussion here about how we feel about the term.
Would you still consider it falling under the "witch house" umbrella? Is it a genuine subgenre, or would you consider it only tangent?

Some examples to clarify in case you need it:

[zin]

The name sucks a bit, but most new genre names do lol

I do see this as part of the big witch house umbrella, it may be different from your average Russian mainstream take on witchhouse, but nevertheless those tracks do tick a lot of the boxes classic witch house tracks occupy.

[esꙮteria]

Yeah I agree the name kinda sucks, but since this has already been used for several years, it seems to late to try and change it

[randomexit]

@zin Ive allways wondered what your take is on when the switchover happened from the more classic salem white ring kind of witchhouse to the rave like generic russian style witchhouse? Like what year did it happen and what were the last of the classic style witchhouse and who turned it into the newer style?

[zin]

@zin Ive allways wondered what your take is on when the switchover happened from the more classic salem white ring kind of witchhouse to the rave like generic russian style witchhouse? Like what year did it happen and what were the last of the classic style witchhouse and who turned it into the newer style?

My personal opinion (so don't take it as research-based or ~FACTS~), based on my observation, is this shift started around 2013-2014, propelled by the growth of Nightmares and 808s youtube channel, the Russian WH boom, and FB groups - all of which were heavily promoting that style of music.

Personally I also think that one cannot ignore the rise of the EDM trap music that was happening at the same time, the white EDM bro culture that spawned from the remains of brostep and soundcloud hiphop groups. The white bro problem is something that was always bothering me, in a way that the early WH scene was quite diverse when it comes to gender, the involvement of women was often hailed as something that makes witch house stand out among other internet genres that were male dominated. If you look at most of the artists making this cliche mainstream WH sound, they're 99% guys.

Around 2014 I was really sick of this sound which resulted in this thread, and me giving up on this forum for many years. Now I think about it, Edith Underground's 2017 debut mixtape "Teen Witch" released under the name Spirit Bored is what made me come back here and dive deeper to look for interesting artists. I think SALEM's second album gave the genre a new life with a number of sick bands and producers that came after that.

Interesting thread from 2012 that was diving into the change of the WH zeitgeist:
https://witch-house.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1401

[esꙮteria]

https://soundcloud.com/mazespurr/s-u-i- ... -w-e-r-v-e

[zin]

https://soundcloud.com/mazespurr/s-u-i- ... -w-e-r-v-e

From 3:30 onwards is

[esꙮteria]

https://soundcloud.com/futxrecultxre/an ... el-suffers

[peklowpeple]

Hi everyone. I just wanna find a people, who knows how make good music . I'm doing something in between a witch house, a synthwave, a DnB and a hip hop, but I don't have enough experience to fix some mistakes in creating and processing music. If you wanna help me, please write me on this resourse, or telegram - @whoispeklowpeple or insta @hoepleasedontcall. I really need your help!

[SES]

DELETED

[zin]

Recently Trashwave has a special place in my heart. The brutally distorted everything in this music has it's own musical relevance.
First i want to say, that the term Trashwave is itself a border hike, because the music has no prominent style of tempo or percussion.
Even the people one may name as Trahwave artists, can refuse the term and dislike it.

I will list some artist, that i will call "Close To Be Called Trashwave".
I don't want to put off someone or insult their art, when sort them into this term. I want to apologize, when i did something wrong.

Trashwave is a very small "scene", that i spectacte mostly in Soundcloud. The music itself uses very distorted synth or even a complete distorted mix. The drums can vary from slow trap-like, wave-like rythm, the drums can be like the dutch hardcore "hakke" music, they can be breakcore jungle-ish, they can even be not and form ambient structures or the music focuses on composition.

So Trashwave touches many other genres and therefor it is like Witch House, which also leaves the form and plays with 4x4 type rythms and everything else.

My opinion is that Trashwave is more manic and while WH is a falling into a void, Trashwave is more a kicking off a cliff and it is like dry eyes or itching skin. The music wants one to push the limits or screams so loud to reach someone, that doesn't feel anymore. The high pitched sounds scratch the ears and it wants to be recognized so hard. Musical experiments are common and a overwhelming use of producing handcraft goes into the art. Like Witch House, we have different styles of mix and master, that takes it's freedom to sound Lo-Fi or compressed and but mostly over-distorted.

The themes of the music are dark, sad, tortured, brutal, hopeful, self-harming, outsiderish, sexual, strange, messed-up, fvcced-up, unknown, powerful, great and small, internetish, anime, trash, etc.
The artstyle of the covers or just images next to the music also uses strange stuff. Images that are "badly" designed or are explicit full of violence or they don't fit in completly and seem random. There is some design and use of forms that are unshaped and look like paintings of the mental ill. Collages like vaporwave art, but more like a nightmare of the darknet or some emofacebookgroup, that lost control.

Like Witch House there is a lot use of unicode. And oh boy, they mastered the use of unicode and they use strange numbers and letters for their titles or names. Like babylonic, mesopotamic unicodes, that look like artwork. Witch House never went that extreme with unicode symbolism. They use angelnumbers like 444, which seemed like a trend. They like to change their profile images and also they like to change their profile names or they delete their profile names at all. The behavior seems strange. The description of their tracks is sometimes cryptic, dumb or has a certain dark messages. Sometimes it seems random and sometimes you feel like there is a message, that can't be really encrypted.

I guess the term Trashwave is in the end a product by the rules of our society. Maybe people feel that this stuff is problematic content, because it speaks from certain people that may have a different vision and come from other backrounds and other types of socialisation. I don't know. And so all that which is unwanted by the mainstream will be labeled as "Trash". I feel like many of the artist are masters of their craft and create music and art, which is honest and is an important sign of our time. Almost a statement like punk, emo or hiphop. Or maybe it's because Trash Metal and they are just trashing their sound, you know. It could also be grinding. I red the term Witchgrind, but Trashwave is just OK.

One artist even states that "there is no such thing as trashwave".

there is no such thing as trashwave by .moonflower


You can hear the Witch House in that, but it goes beyond.

Next one:

⸜⽬ ⸸b⛼a₋rꄍe+sꄍe⁻e⛼n⸸ 𐰘 ⁽ᶠᶿʴ᠄⁾ ᵍᶱʳᵋ⁾ ⾕⸝ by красный порезал


You really here something! The image is also what i told you. Look at the unicodes. That is stuff.

And next 3-66-7:

‎ by 3-66-7
https://soundcloud.com/reconnect3667/eur-eur

There isn't even a title or maybe a unicode symbol i can't see. Very strange music.

Another one by 3-66-7:

さ #deadbluejaycult by 3-66-7


Goes hard on this synth. There is a fable for this blue bird.

Next:

BONEFACE // ORGANIMATIC +SERAPHDIVE von mikano by


Mikano is hard.

Next:

ᗡS˥++ﾒﾒ刀ﾒﾒ＋ӼռӼ＋ﾚ丂り by stereo cross


stereo cross is great. The releases vary a lot and great fresh harsh WH.

More of stereo cross:

MWGA© by stereo cross


ｆ�ｃｋｉｎｇ ａｎｇｅｌｗａｖｅ by stereo cross


2_ɱąཞıʂơƖ5190926374780550546.ɱ℘3 𝐄𝐃𝐓 by stereo cross


Next:

nie jestem wystarczająco dobry (przepraszam) pt.3 by bcm7


bcm7 is more "melodic".

Next:

ကြိုးပါ။ သစ်ပင်ပါ။ ပျော်ရွှင်မှုပါ။ by mvshvrski


Good music for morning hours.

Next:

？ ？ ？ ４ ４ ４ 세상 다 좆까。 by 77-47-50-5a-5b-5d-56-12-5b-54-5e-5f-11-5b-13-5c


Takes it's time

Next:
ܓꦿＧＥＴＨＳＥＭＡＮＥܮ܏܏
by MAZES PURR
https://soundcloud.com/mazespurr/gethsemane

MAZES PURR is sexy.

Next:

→༺˚ೇ˚ひ ˚૩₃ૠsೊ೧༣૩ೇ ᷧ ᷠ ᷚ ᷪ ᷝ ᷤ༻ by
૮₍ ´ ꒳ `₎ა ᵇᵒᵘⁿᵈᵇᵘⁿⁿʸ


Lovely.

Next:

¿а что у тебя под кожей? by ihatemyface
https://soundcloud.com/ihatemyfac3/a-ch ... pod-kozhey

Next:

الانتحار المزدوج 2SAVE THE PLANET KILL YOUR SELF by ᙏᕔꕷҜᕔᕓᕔꕷ


Next:

Duncë̸͓̮͉͈͇͍̖͎̩̞͈́́́̋̇̾͋̈́̾͆͑͘͘͜͠͝ Mꂦrsë̸͓̮͉͈͇͍̖͎̩̞͈́́́̋̇̾͋̈́̾͆͑͘͘͜͠͝l by 𝙒𝙝𝙚𝙧𝙚 𝙎𝙬𝙖𝙣𝙨 𝙒𝙞𝙡𝙡 𝙒𝙚𝙚𝙥


Where Swans Will Weep has also lot of WH-Style tracks. Very talented.

Next:

tsujiura - body (⠱⠬snybun flip) by ⠱⠬snybun


Next:

les souvenirs sont inutiles by crvllly
https://soundcloud.com/crvllly/les-souv ... t-inutiles

Next:

25102021 by aytNctMY3IbCUNT


Next:

rott reproductio by #GR33NWRLDD


Next:

огибая контуры земли 2 by istandards


Next:

COME ON †V∆ND∆L SUICIDAL TEARS by ​​​ ​​​​​​​ ​​​​​​​ ​​​​​​​ ​​​​​​​ ​​​​​ ​​☂


Next:

⥷≺𝕔•*•̴̕͜ ̶̙̈•̴̕͜•̴ ̶̙̈⨠ by 9 ​ ʘ​ ​ ​ 9 ​​ ​ ​ʘ ​ ​ ​​9 ​ ​ ​ ​



So. A few artists. If you look into the reposts and likes then you can find more.

Thank you

I just want to say HOLY SHIT, this post above is the reason why forum format is the best for discussions like this. Incredible research, will dive into those artists bit by bit!

[Dormant]

These are fascinating, I love when it goes from complete chaos into some semblance of structure, and then straight back into chaos before you can get comfortable on many of these tracks. You can tell though that a lot of work went into many of these, despite sounding almost random at times.

I really like the distorted bass, grossly eq'd everything, and glitch fx and tempo manipulation.

reminds me of an album called analog horrorcore, I dont think its part of that scene, but im sure it had influences.

[yaka-anima]

just listened your soundcloud examples, and of course that's witch house. this genre have that thing unique, not all artists have to sound exactly the same. This noisy synth punk reminds me of Sadwrist, or of a more newer artist: Gloomstone. For me is very fun and cool, not too much obscure neither have that perfume of rituals and darkness, but it's for listening when you go for a walk to the park with a pet.

[␠]

@zin Ive allways wondered what your take is on when the switchover happened from the more classic salem white ring kind of witchhouse to the rave like generic russian style witchhouse? Like what year did it happen and what were the last of the classic style witchhouse and who turned it into the newer style?

My personal opinion (so don't take it as research-based or ~FACTS~), based on my observation, is this shift started around 2013-2014, propelled by the growth of Nightmares and 808s youtube channel, the Russian WH boom, and FB groups - all of which were heavily promoting that style of music.

Personally I also think that one cannot ignore the rise of the EDM trap music that was happening at the same time, the white EDM bro culture that spawned from the remains of brostep and soundcloud hiphop groups. The white bro problem is something that was always bothering me, in a way that the early WH scene was quite diverse when it comes to gender, the involvement of women was often hailed as something that makes witch house stand out among other internet genres that were male dominated. If you look at most of the artists making this cliche mainstream WH sound, they're 99% guys.

Around 2014 I was really sick of this sound which resulted in this thread, and me giving up on this forum for many years. Now I think about it, Edith Underground's 2017 debut mixtape "Teen Witch" released under the name Spirit Bored is what made me come back here and dive deeper to look for interesting artists. I think SALEM's second album gave the genre a new life with a number of sick bands and producers that came after that.

Interesting thread from 2012 that was diving into the change of the WH zeitgeist:
viewtopic.php?t=1401

i saw this thread online the other day; it lit some kind of fire within me to be honest. i felt compelled to make an account and respond to this thread. i would like to say my music has grown out of an appreciation of the witch house aesthetic, and i think this is where i would place a significant part of what i am inspired by to create my "sound". i feel this topic of "trashwave" relates to my own journey too, so i would like to share a bit.

when i was starting out in music (about 2-3 years in, 2013/14) i started to collaborate with another artist online known as "$WAGGOT". i would say one of the significant trends we noticed at that time (and what are all genres if not trends over time..) was the decline in quality and inferior reiteration of music that was being released. it wasn't nearly as pronounced at this time, but even so, the "trashiness" of artistic expression was present as indicated with the "trap" sound creeping into witch house.
 
$WAGGOT called the first records we put out together "pop trash". in some ways i think this idea also intersects with some premonition of what was to come with "hyper pop" as well. however, i was really fond of this "trash" concept, and so after a release on Phantasma Disques with my old project, a gradual disinterest with Witch House, and a musical hiatus, i decided i might move in direction to explore the direction of the "trash" concept and created a new project. that project was "spatial manufacture ltd." and that first record was called "EDM t r a s h 2k11" in 2016.

during that time as well i started to shift my listening to artists like sadwrist and basilisk/mazes purr. $WAGGOT's 2016 mixtape "PSEUDO-SUBLIMATION" featured some of sadwrist's productions, and that's what really turned me on to the sound. a lot of these artists that people consider "trashwave" i would consider to be heavily inspired by artists like the 'wrist and VANDAL too. i would describe their sound as something "post-witch house", but i find that genres usually tend to start when artists start to do something that acts as a copy without original. what i mean by that is that is the very essence of "genre" - a phenomenon where in behavior by unconnected individuals creates a seemingly concentrated effort. this behavior is copied from a previous source without an original. the same goes for the "witch house" genre itself.
 
in an age with generative "artificial intelligence", the parallels and coincidences strike me enough to wish to add my thoughts to the discussion for consideration. i welcome thoughts for further discussion.

[idkyetok666]

Thanks for the insight sp and zin.
I had to delete the quotes because i got some errors when using them.

Ive been in love with witchhouse since the 2010s.
so since about 2017 i have been listening to trashwave.
And since im not sure if trashwave is already a decade old or not. (Would love to kow that.)

I wanted to add that i would love for trashwave to be added to the witchhouse timeline.
Or like sp said some kind of post-wh section, since some artists seems very inspired by witchhouse.
To name just one example of the influence: the usage of cryptic sometime undecipherable names of artists and songs alike, which seems like an attitude towards going against mass/broad appeal, which was to me also an ethos that was found in witchhouse and its aesthetic.
Besides the obvious references in sadwrist and sewnfkt using witchhouse songs specifically.

To add abit further context from my expirience with trashwave as a genre.
You mentioned there seemed to be alot artist taking inspiration from vandal and sadwrist.
If im not mistaken it was sort of a fanclub of sadwirst and vandal fans that were producers or started producing and started doing their version of the aesthetic those two presented.

Vandal666 being more of an remixing songs on decks to boost everything to death and be able to use effects. (I have a vivid memory of seeing the production process of vandal somewhere maybe on twitch or on some site) not sure about the accuracy on that.
(For example rollin and scratchin 2 by vandal)

And sadwrist who had just a style of his own with his noisy witchhouse influences but also having no singular definable genre.
And insanely long tracks like Amok ⪻ ⟡ ⪼ koma

Defying how long songs can be. (Its one my altime favs)

I loved the raw noise and deeply emotional sound and how every artists bring something new and unique into the genre so fun to see.
Constantly breaking all the rules of how to structure songs, from tempo to melodies and composition.

The name trashwave, to me is perfect.
As cheesy as this sounds but
One persons trash is another persons treasure.
And to me you many trashwave songs are anthems and instant classics, so this ring very true.

Some trashpanda appreciation.
To me finesir has also been quite the inspiration.


I got to see one trashwave act live so far and i hope there will be many more. Since its such a raw genre and i live the energy it brings to a live setting.

Thanks for all the sounds and for opening this topic last year.
To many more years of amazing sound being found and discussed on this forum.